Discover the exciting world of the Aerospace Village at RSA Conference 2023, and dive into hands-on experiences with cybersecurity experts and cutting-edge technology.
Guests
Steve Luczynski, Senior Manager / Critical Infrastructure Security, Accenture Federal Services [@Accenture] and Chairman of the Board for the Aerospace Village [@secureaerospace]
On LinkedIn | https://www.linkedin.com/in/steveluczynski/
On Twitter | https://twitter.com/cyberpilot22
Henry Danielson, Adjunct Professor/Lecturer, Cal Poly College of Liberal Arts [@CalPolyCLA], Technical Advisor, California Polytechnic State University California Cybersecurity Institute [@CalPolyCCI], and Volunteer at Aerospace Village [@secureaerospace]
On LinkedIn | https://www.linkedin.com/in/henry-danielson-43a61213/
On Twitter | https://twitter.com/hdanielson
At Cal Poly | https://cci.calpoly.edu/about-cci/staff
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Hosts:
Sean Martin, Co-Founder at ITSPmagazine [@ITSPmagazine] and Host of Redefining CyberSecurity Podcast [@RedefiningCyber]
On ITSPmagazine | https://www.itspmagazine.com/itspmagazine-podcast-radio-hosts/sean-martin
Marco Ciappelli, Co-Founder at ITSPmagazine [@ITSPmagazine] and Host of Redefining Society Podcast
On ITSPmagazine | https://www.itspmagazine.com/itspmagazine-podcast-radio-hosts/marco-ciappelli
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This Episode’s Sponsors
BlackCloak | https://itspm.ag/itspbcweb
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Episode Notes
"Discover the exciting world of the Aerospace Village at RSA Conference 2023, and dive into hands-on experiences with cybersecurity experts and cutting-edge technology."
Welcome to ITSPmagazine's RSA Conference 2023 coverage, where we dive into the world of cybersecurity and engage with experts in a week full of fun and exciting activities. We're on the road to RSA Conference 2023 in San Francisco, and one event we can't miss is the Sandbox, specifically the Aerospace Village. In this podcast episode, we're joined by our good friends Steve Luczynski and Henry Danielson from the Aerospace Village to discuss what's in store for us at this year's conference.
The Aerospace Village is a small nonprofit run by volunteers from around the world, aiming to build relationships between government, industry, security researchers, and hackers, inspire people to join the cybersecurity workforce, and promote awareness in the aviation and space sectors. This year, RSA Conference 2023 features a Sandbox where attendees can interact with the latest technical hands-on experiences, learn from experts, and explore what's happening in the cybersecurity world.
In this episode, our guests discuss the various partners and activities in the Aerospace Village, such as CT Cubed's drone quadcopter simulation in AR and VR experience, IntelleGenesis's runway lighting scenario demonstration, and Boeing's continuous security level maintenance activity. You'll also get a chance to try out a real Airbus simulator, courtesy of pen test partners, to understand the potential vulnerabilities in electronic flight bags and their impact on pilot operations.
Join us for an exciting, fun-filled week at RSA Conference 2023, where you can learn, network, and discover the latest trends in cybersecurity. Don't miss out on this unique opportunity to interact with experts, explore cutting-edge technologies, and immerse yourself in the world of aerospace cybersecurity. Be sure to listen, share, and subscribe to ITSPmagazine's podcast for more exciting episodes and insights from the RSA Conference 2023!
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Resources
Learn more, explore the agenda, and register for RSA Conference: https://itspm.ag/rsa-cordbw
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Please note that this transcript was created using AI technology and may contain inaccuracies or deviations from the original audio file. The transcript is provided for informational purposes only and should not be relied upon as a substitute for the original recording as errors may exist. At this time we provide it “as it is” and we hope it can be useful for our audience.
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SPEAKERS
Marco Ciappelli, Henry Danielson , Steve Luczynski , Sean Martin
Sean Martin 00:03
“Come fly with me…” oh, I'm not gonna sing Marco
Marco Ciappelli 00:07
actually sounded pretty good. Right? I was like, What are you doing? No, I know you have your background in music. So
Steve Luczynski 00:16
this is a new aspect of the show that Sean would like to bring in Marco.
Sean Martin 00:21
We're gonna have to start off in song. Yes.
Steve Luczynski 00:25
You can edit it out.
Marco Ciappelli 00:27
No, no, we don't edit this I'm done with edit. And this is all like as it goes, like, like if it was live, like everything that is fun is live. And
Sean Martin 00:37
as as it flies, there's no editing in the air.
Marco Ciappelli 00:43
Well, my reference was to yours was of course to fly in and mine was to be live on location, then get to go talk to people and visit staff and touch and you know, experiment and play with things in person. So that's cool. And that what this people can do, Shawn?
Sean Martin 01:05
Exactly. Well, we're gonna I mean, this is part of our chats on the road to RSA Conference 2023 in San Francisco, a week full of all kinds of fun things. And Marco one we wouldn't miss is the sandbox and most specifically, the aerospace Village and I'm thrilled to have good friend on again to do good friends. I think Hanks been on as well. From the aerospace village Steven Hank, good to see you guys.
Steve Luczynski 01:32
Yeah, thanks, fellas. Good to be back. And knowing that we're gonna see you in person here soon.
Marco Ciappelli 01:38
Yeah, and you know, let's make the distinguished by the way, there is the audio version, the video version if you're watching the video and you're like, hey, I want to catch this up in the car later on. Yeah, there is a video and audio version. And here you can see the wonderful mess behind Steve back which I love I don't all those guys are very hard to get it to this level. I know it I have space as a galaxy behind so wonderful. So chats on the road, Shawn, what is this about shots in the road to RSA. com.
Sean Martin 02:12
I got myself in trouble in the introduction podcast with Linden and Berta, so I'm not going to do that again. No, no can't steer away from the cow jokes. Chapter on the road is where we get to lead up to the actual event. So it's conversations like these. And depending on the situation, sometimes actually, literally in the car, on the road or in on the beach, and recording stuff that matters for for everybody attending RSA conference,
Steve Luczynski 02:47
I get to see where you guys are going to be. Because you always do take good road trip pictures. Because it's a road trip as opposed to just flying out there. So that's exactly Yep,
Marco Ciappelli 02:59
coming from LA is definitely a road trip. For sure. We're not going to fly by you guys. You guys make people fly everywhere. So because they're talking about the aerospace village time to make the introduction again, Steven Henry. Let's make it round. That's 30. Steve. And, you know, at this point, I'd say you know, we're good friend, we'll talk so many time met. And but not everybody knows you. So how about a little introduction by yourself, and then pass it to Henry, and let's dive in what to expect.
Steve Luczynski 03:34
Well, it's great to be back. Thank you, again, you guys are such great hosts, the show you put on and I like hearing about it. And I know some of the folks that are going to be there and what they're doing. But your perspective. And being such a good host bringing us in bringing Henry in. It's awesome. So we really appreciate that. And then like I said, getting to see you on the ground. And I don't know if I've actually seen either one of you in person. From all these years we've been doing this. So that's just that much better. But so, my name is Steve Lozinski for folks who have not have not heard me talk before. I get very excited the aerospace Village. We are a small nonprofit, all volunteers. So it is and it's volunteers from around the world. You've got your California representative there with Henry coming in. Not too far away from the Cal Poly area. I live in Virginia. We got folks all over the US but also in the UK, Japan and we're growing so if you want to learn more pay attention we'll post links and we're always happy to have volunteers but our goal very simple our the way we say it is build relationships between government industry, security researchers and hackers. That's our primary audience building trust getting to know each other so if something happens, we can work together more easily We've already know each other and can get things done. It's inspiring folks to get into the cybersecurity workforce, because we all know that's a big gap. And it's, we really want them to get into the aviation and space sectors because it's just cool. It's airplanes and rockets and all the things that support that, which everybody loves. I know I do. And then it's promoting awareness and making sure that we can help out whether it's bringing a network of smart people together, helping answers, answer questions to media and others. So they know there are really smart folks, Henry, he's one of them working on these hard problems, to make things secure. And that's why we could trust going out there. Henry, your thoughts is a volunteer. I've been in since we started this back in 2019. Henry, I think you've been in a couple years now. interested in your thoughts?
Sean Martin 05:54
Quickly, though, wasn't always aerospace village. Was it, Steve?
Steve Luczynski 05:57
Yeah, that is that is correct. Yep. Absolutely. Thank you for that we started off in 2019 as the aviation village, we had space as a component of the airplanes, the air traffic management, the communication, navigation and the space elements. But really, it's the realization that yeah, we can't, there's no kind of about it. Space is a major part of that ecosystem. And so it was a very easy shift to say, You know what, let's make sure it's very clear aerospace village, encompassing all that goes into both of those very critical sectors.
Sean Martin 06:35
Henry, sorry.
Henry Danielson 06:36
Awesome. Yeah, no worries. So I remember when walking by that, and Bo, I think was very much involved in that in the beginning. And anyway, my name is Hank Danielson. I'm over here at Cal Poly in the central coast of California, in between Santa Barbara and San Francisco. Really enjoy, basically trying to understand and help young people get into the security space. And specifically, we have something called the Space grand challenge. And it's middle school and high school students. We've been doing it for six years. In the beginning, it was odd, we took people and they came directly to Cal Poly and stayed in the dorms for a weekend. And we set up real immersive environments, so that they would feel like they were in the environment and what what got hacked. We've worked with satellites. We've done the medical industry, we were actually at DEF CON at one year with Bo in his biohacking village as well. But my passion is getting young people into that space. I work with JPL Space Force, and space Missile Command. I'm a professor at Cal Poly. It sounds like a bunch of ego, but it's not. I'm just a happy guy and super agreeable. And I just really enjoy doing what I do. I'm also a goon at DEF CON, which is a really big fun thing for me to do, as well as be a part of the staff and giving back to my community. And that's exactly why I joined the aerospace village been doing satellite compromises and hacking and understanding how space and or biology works. And really, really getting into that. And I wanted to get back to aerospace village. And so I've been doing volunteers for a while here now this is my third year. And just super excited. The the community is amazing. What you learn from someone sitting with them in 10 minutes is just just great. And what a great community it is and just loving what I do. And I'm really excited about RSA, it's gonna be awesome in our sandbox and the people that we bring there, stupefying from you know, having wonderful demos to actually flying a plane, let's do some, you know, actual plane flying and looking out
Steve Luczynski 08:45
to simulator. Actual simulator simulator.
Henry Danielson 08:49
Well, I feel like I was really flying it so.
Steve Luczynski 08:53
So if there's any doubt at all, what Henry talked about in the sense of what Cal Poly does and how it fits with our mission and why we love working with them and having them as a partner supporting what they're doing growing interest growing the workforce. But holy cow, the energy like this is dialed down the the happiness and energy brings I absolutely enjoy. It's so awesome. He knows the community, you bring so much in and that's what we're hoping that you know, when your audience if they come out to RSA please come by see us Penry is going to be there, I'm going to be there. And these are the kinds of folks you're going to meet and learn from, and it's just so much fun to do.
Henry Danielson 09:41
Thank you, Steve. I appreciate it. And I'm humbled, humbled to be a part of this team. And it's every year I learned something new and it's super fun.
Sean Martin 09:50
I remember in in Vegas, yes. You guys do in the walk around and the energy. The energy is you Energy say I'm not gonna excited to be be on location with you. So let's, um, let's talk about the village itself. Kind of the big picture there, Steve. What's, I mean, Henry talked about a few things in there. But what's, what's the purpose? And what are some of the main attractions?
Steve Luczynski 10:19
Yeah. And I think you're talking about specifically what we're bringing to RSA this year. Right? Yeah. So, so within that mission of what I talked about one of the the nice thing for the village, but what marries up nicely with RSA, RSA, a vendor heavy business audience. But what they're trying to do very purposely, in this area they call the Sandbox is they want to bring in more technical hands on experience what's happening, learn from experts, nobody's going to try and sell you anything. I'm sure if you want to have that conversation, you can go somewhere else. Yeah, they'll gladly sell stuff to you have no doubt. But the whole point of the Sandbox is to be able to interact on not the craziness of the vendor floor. It's not the mainstage talks. It's a combination in the sense of we have some folks that are going to be up on stage that we have brought in that I'll tell you about. But also in our part of the village, we have our partners that support our work, they support our work throughout the year, the events that we go to that we bring them into because they offer such great expertise and insight from their different businesses, and gives opportunities to teach people so for example, CTQ, very small company doing some great work, they have built both a in person, Mars rover simulated machine, and a drone. They also built virtual versions, because they started all of this before when COVID hit. And so they use those to teach engineers, your engineering to design this perfect rover that's going to go to Mars that you're not going to be able to do a lot of updates and changes to. But here's what happens if you don't design cybersecurity. And here's the problems that you can induce if you don't think about that early. So while it's an engineering model of not an airplane thing necessarily. It is representative of what goes on in this sector, when you're dealing with spacecraft when you're dealing with aircraft and the importance of putting cybersecurity in. So not only are you going to see this in person, right in front of you and talk to these folks, but they've got the AR VR version of things. So you can really experience and see what that's all about. That's one of our partners, there's another partner and tele Genesis, they are bringing in a kit, where they use a runway lighting scenario, to demonstrate the importance of industrial control system cybersecurity elements, and how that can impact aircraft light, or the lighting systems that pilots use when they're landing at night and in bad weather. So very simple demonstrations, but again, in a technical means that you're not going to get on the vendor floor or in a mainstage talk at RSA. The third one that's also coming in is Boeing. They've been a partner of ours for several years now. And they have an activity to demonstrate not only is it the cybersecurity of an aircraft, but how do you maintain that continuous security level on that continuous authorization to make sure things are good on all of those complex systems. And then like Henry said, it's always a fun one, our partners pen test partners, as the name of that group, they have built an Airbus simulator. And if you've been to our sandbox in the past, they had a very large cockpit setup, they've actually built a much smaller, more portable, easy to move around. Because of all the work they do to bring it to these different events. But what they're demonstrating is with the iPad, that pilot use, it's called an electronic flight bag, all the charts all the the data and calculations they bring into the cockpit, because they use that for their takeoff data. And if that has a vulnerability, which they have found, and it's not fixed, and somebody wanted to do something bad to it, here's the ways it can affect what the pilots doing. So it's a great demonstration of the simplicity of these systems. And how the smallest thing can cause a problem but they can demonstrate and because they've disclosed it and had it fixed the importance of these things. While they may be simple, they can have large impacts. So that's a great story that they tell
Marco Ciappelli 14:55
sounds like a lot of fun like my kind of fun actually
Sean Martin 14:58
I am just gonna hang out in the village, Marco.
Marco Ciappelli 15:03
Well yeah, when we see I kind of kind of referred to the fact that we met because in my head there is DEF CON village when we met Monroe and, and all the other guys and and I you know and I went out there
Steve Luczynski 15:16
Yeah, I was just thinking about that
Marco Ciappelli 15:19
It was Coops? That's right, here's here's my thing I'm thinking about this convergence is merging of, you know, space in our airplane and, and I'm gonna make a little advertisement for myself with I got the pleasure of having to episode with Eileen Collins, Commander of the Space Shuttle for mission. And the second one is coming up soon where we talk about the future of space exploration. And one question she said she likes to answer is what is space? And she goes into explaining, you know what, you know, do we consider a space, certain point in the air above the atmosphere when you're going around. But then it just started, as you said, the convergence of the two that it just, it's all together, I mean, even just communication, and we we get this security, we get on a plane where like it's safe. And it is way safer than we used to be. But all the things behind that. So a little bit of the background. Maybe Steve and Harry have a How can you embrace all of these and how everything works together? We don't have five hours. But you know, maybe a little summary of why it's important that this came together.
Steve Luczynski 16:41
And where you want to you want to start because I know I can I can go on for quite a while.
Henry Danielson 16:45
Yeah, sure. And I'll stick into the well, I'll talk a little bit about Cal Poly. He's currently they had a wonderful grant from the Air Force Research Labs. And they have a current setup where they bought a wonderful Cessna plane blows my mind, it has a little logo on there and everything. And what they're doing is amazing. They're doing two things. One is they have a control center, that is a simulator, and then it actually connects with the plane. So what's happening is they'll have 12 students in the hangar, actually, it's the upstairs part of the hangar, and they're connected with the plane, as well as the pilot as they're going out. So the students are actually watching what's happening. And every week, one of the students gets to actually take control, and show and tell, hey, the real pilot, this is what you need to do. So it's a simulator, but with a real person in a real plane. And the other parts that they're trying to do is understanding jamming, spoofing, and to see what maybe hacker Hank could do to block the communication from that plane, and their actual control tower, which again, is a hangar. So that's just kind of one of the things that the learn by doing and Cal Poly and aerospace village is definitely part of. And I think it's just really amazing, because we're doing what you said Marco, the convergence of space, as well as cybersecurity. So trying to protect others that are flying around, is what you're asking. That's, that's in my head, one of the forefront things, and I like to call it with the industry. Security by design, and you have to start there, where most of the time we go after the fact. And we've changed that even with, I'll just throw out sister Jen, and all of her wonderful, wonderful people at CES a changing that, that and they're even doing it for aerospace as well as space. So they're thinking, and then also the Aerospace Corporation has a wonderful thing out there. That's very similar to mitre. It's called Sparta, and it talks about the attacks that happen in space. So I'll settle down there, but I just wanted to give you kind of a an overview of what my thoughts were from the Cal Poly side as well as to the aerospace village and cybersecurity
Steve Luczynski 19:08
and that, that those are some of our partners that have participated with us at previous events and continuing to support them. And I think the other the other aspect in addition to what Hank was talking about, even going back to what you said, Marco is, when you look at all the critical infrastructure sectors that are currently defined by government, there's 16 Total spaces, not one of them. There's discussions about whether or not it shouldn't be, but when you do the analysis, space absolutely plays a role in all of them either a primary role or even just just a secondary role, but still a significant secondary role when you're doing a financial transaction in the banking sector. That's all done through GPS, which is not something people know about and I've talked about that even on here before but it's just It's not something that occurs to you. So like, Why do I worry about space? Well, in the aviation context, sure. I've got airplanes going around the communications, the navigation, the safety involved. What about satellites? Yep, there's commerce. But that's where I get my XM Radio folks are doing that. Or when I'm watching a movie on an airplane, or whatever's going on selfie, you know, all of those things, internet coverage, things of that nature. But it's all these other areas in our lives that we don't always realize. So the importance of these sectors is not just travel or the G wiz of what NASA does, and all that it's all these other values that that sector brings to our lives because of these other activities.
Sean Martin 20:50
Yeah, and I mean, you guys do an amazing job of bringing all of those parts together, from from the research community, to industry, to government and policy makers. And Steve, I want to go there with you have a session at RSA and I think, at RSA Conference, and there's, I mean, it's one thing is amazing to have a village in the sandbox, right to bring exposure and raise awareness for this. Even even cooler, maybe, but to have have a spot on the main stage.
Steve Luczynski 21:26
Yeah. So that the that whole setup that was really impressive, that RSA, cut this space, dedicated it for us to all of us, there's other sandboxes there, if you want to focus on industrial control systems, there's car hacking sandbox that looks at car systems, how they operate, not just security side, I believe Internet of Things will also have a portion there, right? So so you've got these different groups that have their subject matter focus areas, like we do, but it's important to get into the detail. That's right, exactly. And so you've got that hands on portion, like I mentioned, but then when they bring in speakers, and my gosh, the range of speakers I remember previous years, Chris Krebs, when he was director of Sousa, he's, he's come in and talk before, and others like him. I know this year, we are bringing in two sessions that the aerospace sandboxes behind along the lines of what you were saying. One of them is Andre Causton. He's a research professor at University of Finland. He's also the CEO of menari.io. And he's going to talk about the research that him and his group have done related to space systems. And particularly, one of the examples that really stood out to me is emergency locator beacons. So if you're, you crash in the ocean, you're lost as a hiker in the woods, these emergency locators go to a satellite system, and it's around the world. And so these things, again, have impact on our daily lives. The other session, and I'm actually really excited because I'm going to be a part of it is doing a fireside chat with Hector Morales, from FAA, air traffic organization. And the idea is, we think of FAA, they're a regulator, they're the hammer, they're the ones the industry worries about in a bad way. But that's not completely true in the sense that when they're looking at cybersecurity, they know, yes, we have this regulatory role. But how do we encourage and support collaboration? How do we make sure we're talking to these other parts of industry and the security researchers that have this technical knowledge? And how do we leverage that? And how do we work together, and it's being able to share the story of the different things that they support, which I really enjoy and our village benefits from? Because those are efforts that we are supporting, and we want to bring in that Governor, government partner to continue growing that and building more of that collaboration wherever we can.
Marco Ciappelli 24:11
Yeah, and I, you know, I want to go back to Hank and talk about education, because you know, you've made a big distinction. I mean, that's visit RSA Conference is is a business, it's about education, as well, and you guys are just about education. And you can do it with kids, you can do it. And you talk to Hank about the initiative that you guys have, but so there's all these people that are going to be at RSA Conference, come with the company come with an objective but why not taking the opportunity to go and visit all these villages and learn about things and maybe they're not in your line of business, but you know, in a way they are they are in your line of life. So tell me about the importance and why a your success. I feel like I'm kind of sleeping compared to you when I'm talking. And the other thing is why you do all this? You know, like why education is so important?
Henry Danielson 25:10
Great. Well, I first of all, I tell my students, the first day of class, I have ADHD, ADD LMNOP and hyperactivity. So just check off all those boxes. So if I go spacey a little, it's because of my brain and how it works. joy that they respect that. But to your point, education? Yes, absolutely. And I want to highlight another one. One of our vice presidents of Cal Poly, that of it is Bill, one of my mentors and great friends working with cube sats. I don't know if you know, but Cal Poly was the originator with cube sats, Stanford, and Cal Poly San Luis Obispo were the first ones that built it, there's no ego, it's attached, it just was they came up with something, they did something good. And now look, we're looking at Starlink, and Amazon and all these other companies trying to get this is blows my mind, plant trying to get, you know wonderful internet, to places where we normally not been able to have it. Now there was balloons before and now these, these actual CubeSats constellations of 10,000 of them, 8000 of them is working. And so my point is it's educating yourself to understand some of these things. And I loved what Steve said about GPS. Right now people don't realize that is a critical infrastructure. It is. It's also it's for wartime, and protecting us as well. There's so many facets go along with that. And I think with RSA, the education that you can actually bring and come and see, you will take yourself to the next level. Even if you walk around to three villages, I guarantee you will learn three to five things that you didn't know about that space or that discipline, and just watching it really gets me I don't know, juiced up, because I think it's so cool to part to help people understand things that they may not. And later in life, they may make a change or do something or help others or want to give, you know, to an organization that's making things better and doing cybersecurity. So I hope that answered a little bit of your education question. But yes, being pro education, and I think it's just really important. And you know, that, that underpinnings of something simple, that turns into something huge, is just amazing to me, and I just get infatuated. And I'm learning every day, I was just hardening Active Directory today from the Cisco people, you know, how do you do that out the gate instead of doing it after the fact. So anything from computing all the way up to the space genre, the Eleos and the G O's. And hopefully, you'll learn by doing and go, go check out what I'm talking about Eleos and G O's. So that's what I
Sean Martin 27:52
say about your point. And the two of you are exemplary of this. Everything we've kind of said to this point is go and suck out of the village as much as you can.
Steve Luczynski 28:04
That's what we're there for. That's what it is fun to share this. And for those of you who don't know, RSA has college day on that last Thursday, where they I think they just open it up and let students in. And of course, they pull every trinket off the vendor for possible. But when those students come rockin into the sandbox, they're awesome. Because they are the same energy as Henry, they want to learn, they want to know more, they ask Where can I go find out more about this. And that's where like, here you go, we got websites, we got people we know, you want to learn more about Boeing or you want to learn more about these other partners, we're talking about, Oh, you want to work with the FAA? Here, go talk to this guy. It's just all of that coming together. That's our whole purpose. How do we connect these folks to learn these things and put that energy to good use, and inspire the next generation of folks to come in and do this after us? Exactly. I
Henry Danielson 29:01
want to inject really quick if I can, you know, security researchers are awesome. But sometimes companies don't want to work with them. There's a big hesitation. And Steve in the aerospace village and the rest of the crew have changed that landscape. And that, to me is heartwarming, as as a hacker on the side, as a social engineer, as well as a ethical hacker, you know that that to me is really powerful. When they bridge those two gaps, man, that's awesome. Yep.
Sean Martin 29:32
You led me to the other point I wanted to make, which is why not go and contribute? As well as suck everything out of it that you can.
Steve Luczynski 29:42
Well, I mean, we are open to the contributors. And that contribution is, you know, think about the things that I described if you are interested because you have equipment and activities that demonstrate that teach these concepts. If you have folks don't want to come in and talk. Yes. If you think you would like your money to go to a good cause, like this nonprofit, I will absolutely help you with that. But it's that entire range of things that we offer that that's where we the benefit is our audience gets this. The folks who bring this in the interactions they have with the audience the benefits to their company, to their research, it's motivating to their teams that they bring in. It works very well. Absolutely. Yeah,
Sean Martin 30:34
the story of the ad store you just mentioned, right? The the, the end of the day, these are all systems that communicate, store data, transmit data act on data, yes, they may use different protocols and different operating systems and different API's and different, but it's still systems. And so the more we can work together,
Steve Luczynski 30:57
and I don't want the general public to worry about that. I want them to go, I don't know, but they got it. I'm going to get on this airplane, and I'm not going to worry about it. I'm all the things I have to worry about. It's not going to be the cyber side. And all the things to worry about in space stuff. It's not going to be those particular aspects. Because here's the crew, I've met him I've seen what they do. It's great. Yes, I my trust is well placed and continued to be that way,
Marco Ciappelli 31:24
you know, is a way to think ahead, right? So I love the whole space exploration thing. And the other day, I'm looking at the European Space Agency, and in the American one and the giant Japanese, they're all working together, because now it's time to make a time standard zone on the moon. Because, you know, it's not just keeping the time. Apollo me showing us the Artemis Musa is actually the time of maybe there are two three different rovers and then the community that we're going to build there. So just by thinking that it's not that far away, I mean, the future is kind of here so that that connection between you know, the, you're gonna need that communication and all of that it really, it's kind of like when the Explorer went on the new continent, and all of a sudden is like, yeah, hey, that's everyday thing. Now we're just fly there. I feel like going to the moon and maybe on Mars, and somewhere else is gonna come soon. So we got to think ahead, right? All of this is a way to think ahead. So what's what's the future? Looking like? Come on,
Henry Danielson 32:33
can I can I say? You want to go first? Steve, you know, I get
Marco Ciappelli 32:38
you both. Don't be jealous.
Steve Luczynski 32:40
Okay, so that was me pointing to you and all of their energy, please.
Henry Danielson 32:44
So one of the things that I'm proud to work on and you can GTS that I like to tell my students Google that stuff, or Google that shizzle, if you know what I mean. But I work with Vint Cerf and the interplanetary networking special interest group. And this is a wonderful group that is planning the policy and the next generation of a Deep Space Network. How do you work with countries all over? To say, Hey, these are the protocols, by the way, and we have to change that because we're going to be on the moon pretty soon with 5g is my thoughts, right? That's gonna be one of the things they set up well, probably seven GE by the time, you know, technology changes so fast. But my point is 20 years we've been waiting event was one of the original for the TCP IP stack, and worked at JPL and all over the place for the Deep Space Network. And that is our future. It's coming. And they're trying to figure out with all these other groups, and that is the most fascinating group, because there's seven 912 Different countries on that call, that are trying to work together to come up with policies and different things. And my other thing is the future and workforce development. My last little point, with our space grand challenge that we have, we just ran it, we're going to ran run it again in May, we'll do it again in February 24, middle and high school students, you'd be blown away by the time they leave their understanding how to sniff a packet with Wireshark. And understanding what a Deep Space Network is, how the bundle protocol works, you go on, I don't know what that means, Henry? Well, they do. And to me, that is really changing the landscape. Because the next generation are what I like to call our, you know, cyber warriors that are up and coming. Those kids are going to be able to work for JPL or work for NASA, because they're going to develop the systems that help protect us for the next generations to come. So those are my two little snippets for space grand challenge again, and hopefully we get to put a couple of links in there about IP and SIG and, and other groups that we're doing and
Marco Ciappelli 34:45
what you can definitely come back and talk about that on another podcast. I mean,
Steve Luczynski 34:52
only and those are not small snippets. Those are huge, significant issues. And you know, Henry Henry's in deep space networks, and I'm starting to think back to what you mentioned Marco, the whole cislunar and the traffic management and setting up waystations. And just things that you've never, we've never even considered, and they were born out of Apollo, but now they're really, really being applied, and then come back even further. So you're thinking of the future, right? So you've now we're into your supersonic aircraft are coming back, right? You've got airlines buying and investing. And there's, there's goodness there. And there's now new cybersecurity concerns. And so being involved with that, and then take it, I'll go all the way down to urban and other advanced Air Mobility and autonomous Air Mobility capabilities, and then down to the simplest drones and all that there. So there's, there's the work that already is there, which is significant. And then there's all these other things that we've mentioned. That's a whole new universe of stuff. So, again, the importance of the workforce, the importance of building in cybersecurity throughout and being able to stay ahead, let's not relearn the lesson, let's learn from it, and apply those so that we can do better as we go forward.
Sean Martin 36:20
That all starts in the village.
Henry Danielson 36:22
I think another interesting.
Steve Luczynski 36:24
I like that idea. I may have to share some credit with others. But yeah,
Henry Danielson 36:27
I also think to the cool future, how they're gonna have these planes come down, just land, go up to Elio seven or eight times drop off a few cube sets come back down SIP zap Zip Zap zips up. The future is just I don't know, we're really living in a wonderful time. And we're lucky to be here right now. And I just think that's really amazing. And Paso Robles has applied for a spaceport. So that's another cool thing. I'm living locally, and I want that to happen. I want to see, you know, those kinds of airplanes come and drop off our wonderful cube sats for the students to learn and do science and, and do those cool things. So anyway,
Sean Martin 37:08
fast food joint next to it. What do you say? I'm gonna open up a fast food joint next to me.
Steve Luczynski 37:16
Hanging out, hanging out with the deck so you could watch everything and they can come inside to get the food. I'm with it. Right? That's
Henry Danielson 37:23
awesome. Awesome. Space burgers.
Marco Ciappelli 37:28
Rocket burger.
Henry Danielson 37:29
Rocket burger. There you go.
Sean Martin 37:33
So you were showing something earlier, Hank? Oh, yeah, my
Henry Danielson 37:36
badge is part of my life. So is Steve's he just doesn't admit it. But every year in RSA as well as DEF CON, there's badges everywhere. What are they? Great question. Thanks for asking the person in the back. What they are is fun things to hack. Fun things to learn how to solder fun ways to share a piece of information that you want to share with others. There's something called Scherzi add ons or silly add ons if you don't want to use abusive language on on the internet. But anyway, it's a really fun way. And a lot of times, hackers and others use electronics to put puzzles or challenges on them. And we've created somewhere it's a satellite and you go on a website and do a bunch of cross scrape cross site scripting and or you're going to do some SQL injection or SQL whichever planet you're on. So it's a fun way to play with devices, solder them, as well as learn maybe there's a Caesar cipher on there some kind of encryption as a person learning about security, they are wonderful devices and having students learn how to solder. I'm right up in there with young people understanding circuitry and electronics because they're everything heck there in your toaster, friend, you know, you can flip that sucker over and and do it. And I got a card for my dad, that was you know, you open it up, and it plays a sound or whatever, right? Well, I ripped that thing apart and there was badge life underneath it. And it's playing you know, a Snoopy song or something or whatever it was, but those are the and I want to reverse engineer it. Why did they make it so big? You could have been this big, you know, I'm thinking in my head or but anyway, badge life really fun way to get people interested. And they have blinky lights, I mean, like blinky lights, so
Steve Luczynski 39:31
And the beauty is RSA again in the Sandbox is supporting it. So this is not to be confused with your standard for those of you who have been RSA, the giant badge with your name and scanning and all that. This is specific to the sandbox, so show up early. I'm sure there's going to be limited numbers, but they purposely had someone designed so it represents the different sandboxes villages that I've described and what we've been talking about and They've also got little add ons that you can go around. So as you interact, and you talk to these folks that you can add to your badge it is it's absolutely it's, it's fun to do, because of that kind of interaction with the people. It's fun to do, because there's usually something buried in the badge. And you have to figure out what it is. And you usually have to talk to somebody to do it. So on your own the technology side, the people interaction side, and it is it's a blinky light, that looks cool. So they they're a lot of fun to do, and RSA is bringing that in.
Marco Ciappelli 40:34
And I want to make one last comment as we're running out of time. And Shawn will do like a nice recap, because he's really good at it. But the villages, right, I mean, that we didn't, we didn't talk much about the DEF CON, the origin of the villages, you know, if not many people had the, I mean, the fantastic experience to be there. I consider myself lucky. And that's again, what we were referring when we almost meet Steve, there, and Hank was there. But the meaning of this village, they're all volunteers, they're all people passionate there is you know, the lockpick in one, he's the the ham radio, there is all you can think about security's there. And you guys are now going around. And I made a joke late this long time ago with Sean and Bryson port from the, you know, talking about the village, and I call it the circus, because I had in mind the itinerant tan that you bring somewhere, you rebuild it from scratch, and you give access to many different people in many different location. You know, it's become like a never ending joke with Bryson. There's one and the ICS village. But here's the truth. And I love to see this going out. I say I want to see a going at RSA in Singapore, I want to see it everywhere. And the fact that you have a website, people can interact. Not everybody can travel. But they can get to experience and learn remotely. So that's my, my big appreciation for you representing an entire community of villages.
Steve Luczynski 42:15
Yeah, thank you for that. I do appreciate it. And to be a part of it is just awesome. Unfortunate for COVID. But wow, the lesson in the sense of what we've done with virtual where I've spoken at a conference in Argentina, virtually I wish I would have been able to go but that kind of global reach things we've done in the UK. And we continue to do because it still works for our audience who wants to watch and then be able to get out there and support others in their conferences. Absolutely.
Sean Martin 42:51
And I heard Singapore so I'm going to do the Singapore one again.
Steve Luczynski 42:57
carry your bag if you
Henry Danielson 42:57
need help. I'm hoping we can get the fast plane there. Steve, you got? Right.
Marco Ciappelli 43:04
I don't care Foster's low. That's always a great place to.
Sean Martin 43:08
Yes, absolutely. And until then, we'll we'll see you in San Francisco. Yes. The high five sandbox in the village in the virtual simulator playing with rovers and in cube sats and looking at Boeing systems inside out.
Henry Danielson 43:30
Thanks RSA as well for having us and really a huge shout out to them. They're amazing people. Yeah, exactly.
Sean Martin 43:38
So thanks. Thank you, Steve. And Hank, for for taking the time to share with us all this cool stuff and for taking the time to put it all together. I know that a lot of work that goes into this. And we're going to collect a gazillion links.
Steve Luczynski 43:52
Yes, absolutely. And I have to mention Adrienne, another one of our volunteers. Yes, you just moderated a panel at women in cybersecurity event. Again, an amazing volunteer. She's directly part of the RSA planning team with Henry and I, and again, can't do this without folks like her and that also support you all again, great partners with us and really appreciate happy to support anytime we can.
Sean Martin 44:20
Mark said to miss satin to miss Adrienne on this recording. Well, hopefully we'll get her on location in San Francisco, for sure. Good to do that. Alright, so thanks, everybody for listening. And stay tuned for notes with all the links that I mentioned. And, of course, more conversation. We actually have two more related to the aerospace village the we're going to we're going to chat with Ken Monroe from Arrow pen test partners. And Adam and team from c t cubed as well. So much more to come as part of RSA Conference coverage. Stay tuned, everybody.
Marco Ciappelli 44:57
Yep, share, subscribe. Be Merry